Let’s Discuss: Intimacy in YA?

Posted 4 July, 2013 by Linda @ (un)Conventional Bookworms in Discussion Posts / 36 Comments

Let's Discuss - (un)Conventional BookviewsLet’s Discuss is a weekly post hosted by The Fiction Conniption and oh, Chrys. The discussion posts are supposed to have something to do with books, but you can pretty much choose your own topic. You can link up to your discussion post at both blogs, and also visit other posts and participate in the discussions they are having. When you link up, it should be to a post made in the past seven days, even if The Fiction Conniption and Oh, Chrys both post theirs every Thursday. You don’t have to post weekly discussion posts, and you can participate when you feel like it.

Let’s Discuss: Intimacy in YA

Yeah, I know… I just had to get it out there straight away, you know? I’m a mom, and I have two teenagers (plus two who are younger) and we discuss absolutely everything openly in our family. When the children have questions about drugs, alcohol, intimate relationships, boyfriends/girlfriends, homosexuality, unemployment, health problems etc – we talk about it all. Sometimes, we are all a little bit embarrassed, but the conversations still flow very well.

One of the things I’ve been thinking about a lot lately is intimate scenes  in YA novels (0r the lack of it). In my mind, YA is written mainly for youth between 13-14 and maybe 17-18 years old. You know, the age when they change, their bodies transform, and they are both awkward and beautiful, confident and scared, sure of themselves and naive all at the same time. And what do they really have to help them learn more about all these feelings they are suddenly having? Some have parents they can talk to – but let’s face it – discussing feelings, falling in love and having an intimate relationship is not exactly the thing you like most to talk to your parents about. Even if you have really cool parents (you know, like my kids have!). So, they have friends they can talk to – but what kind of experience do their friends have? Then, there are books. But frankly, I think that relationships in YA novels are not very balanced. And often either the girl or the guy (or in books that dare to describe a gay couple – one of the people in that couple) is a little creepy, or has loads of experience while the other doesn’t.

If teens don’t feel comfortable talking to their friends, or can’t find what they are looking for in books, there is the internet. And I think that’s what really, really scares me! I haven’t tried it in a long time, but typing in anything that has to do with love or s-e-x  in a search engine is truly scary! The pictures that suddenly flash on my screen has nothing to do with love! (At least not in my mind – I realize this might not the case for other people) And those images are not what I want my 16-year-old son or 18-year-old daughter think is the norm. Especially when it comes to the first love, first relationship, first time of going all the way. Intimacy – to me – is supposed to have at least a little bit of love (OK – I would like it to be all about the love! I admit it) but that’s not very easy to find.

So – I guess I want us to talk about two different things here today – and I would really like some help! The first is the lack of s-e-x (preferably in a serious relationship, and with consenting ‘older’ teens) in YA books. I love it when I find one where there is a couple that starts dating, then really fall in love, and finally, they make love – and there is at least a little bit of showing what they are doing – and them having sex makes sense in the overall story-arc and plot! If you have some books to recommend to me (yeah, I love reading YA, too!) so I can share them with my teens, I’d be really grateful.

I can even start, because there have been some books that have teenagers (or young adults if you like that better) who develop a relationship, a real and sane relationship, where the readers see what they feel while they are being so very intimate the first time (it doesn’t have to be the first time ever for either of them) and that shows some tenderness along with their excitement. Where the characters love each other, and don’t just use each other to find out what it’s all about…

One of the books where I thought this was really well done is in Jeri Smith-Ready’s Shade where there is a short, but very well described scene. This scene also shows how it is easy to feel embarrassed, among all the other feelings one can have when going all the way – even when it happens with someone we love! And I think it’s important that YA books also depict this – that it can be safe that kids need to know to take care of themselves and their loved ones when they make the decision to make love.

Foz Meadow has written a really good post about Why YA sex scenes matter. And there was a great article in The Guardian that I can’t for the life of me find right now – but two authors were talking about the importance of giving teens another way to learn about intimacy. I have also found some blogs who aren’t afraid to talk about YA and sex, like E. M Kokie’s post In Our Own Words. I have also found a great discussion post on Pretty Deadly Reviews called Does Sex Have a Place in YA Lit?

I would also love to hear your thoughts about this. And you don’t have to agree with me at all! I can understand that other readers would like their YA books to be more innocent, and that’s OK. I also know that other parents don’t even want to think about their children growing up in that way, and I totally get that as well. Thanks for stopping by today!

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Linda @ (un)Conventional Bookworms

About Linda @ (un)Conventional Bookworms

Linda is an English as foreign language teacher and has a Master's degree in English Language and Literature. She's an avid reader, blogger, compulsive one-clicker and a genre omnivore. Ever since she learnt how to read she has been seen with a book or two in her hands everywhere she goes.

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36 responses to “Let’s Discuss: Intimacy in YA?

  1. I’m with you! I’m always pleasantly surprised when I find sex in young adult books. Sex is a very real part of teenage life and that’s not something we should just ignore. There are plenty of 16, 17 and 18 year olds having sex, so I think including it in YA makes those books more realistic and relatable for teens.

    And on a similar subject, I get annoyed when people say “new adult is just YA with sex” as if that’s a bad thing. First of all, there’s a lot more to NA than just sex. But even if there wasn’t, sex is a big thing missing from YA books that actually exists in the real world. That’s why it makes some NA books feel more realistic than YA, because it includes something that most YA pretends doesn’t exist.

    Ashley recently posted: Beside Your Heart by Mary Whitney
    • I agree with you completely! And I think it’s sad that NA is labeled like that, too. It seems a little hypocritical sometimes that YA books often have characters who wait until they’re married before they have sex… When we look at statistics for teenage pregnancies, it shows that pretty young teenagers start to have sex. And either because they don’t know better, or because they think it can’t happen to them – they get pregnant without wanting to.

      Thanks for stopping by Ashely! I would love it if you have a YA book or two to recommend to me 🙂

  2. HA! You’re so right! I do think there can be love scenes in YA books, if they’re done tastefully and with tact. I remember reading Richelle Mead’s Vampire Academy and I believe she did a great job writing the love scenes (I might be biased though, since I love Dimitri 😛 )

    And about what Ashley said about NA. It’s true that NA is seen as YA with sex, but I think it’s mostly the fault of the publishers. Or the people who decided there was a need for a new genre between the “adult” part of the literature and the YA part. I, personally, don’t think it was all that necessary, but maybe I’m wrong…

    Great topic, by the way, I don’t think I said that! *oops*

    • Thanks Ruby! I love VA as well, but I have to admit I can’t remember any ‘real’ love scenes there :O maybe it’s time for a re-read? I agree that the NA / YA thing is a little tricky, but for me, I think most NA novels I have read also have older characters than the YA novels I usually read.

      Thanks for stopping by to participate 🙂

    • From an adult point of view, I totally get what you mean, Stormi. However, since a lot of teenagers read YA as well, I think it’s almost a little strange that there is no sex in YA books. I would like there to be some more stories where it’s realistically told how the relationship develops to that stage.

      Thanks for stopping by 🙂

  3. I don’t have problems with Y/A books having sex scenes. As long as it’s important to the plot, then why not? What irked me is that there are Y/As out there which integrate sex scenes into the story just for the sake of doing it or just trying to come up with a Y/A rip off of Fifty Shades of Grey.
    The Y/A books with sex scenes that I really love is Under the Never Sky and Vampire Academy.

    Charlotte Fiel recently posted: I Am Now on Bloglovin
    • Oh, I agree, adding sex just for the sake of having sex is just as illogical as having it fade out to black if it should be a part of the story 🙂 I haven’t read Under the Never Sky yet, thanks for the recommendation Charlotte!

  4. One of the books I’ve read that discussed intimacy well, and included safe sex (more on that later) was Dare You To, by Katie McGarry. Although the relationship between the guy and the girl was a little complicated, it was developed well, and was healthy. The thing I liked the most was how Katie included the ‘safe’ part to the scene, without feeling preachy. It was a pretty funny scene, actually.

    Apart from intimate scenes, the thing that worries me the most is how creepiness is romanticized. I have read enough unhealthy relationships, and while I can tell the difference (I’m a teen myself)between a healthy and unhealthy relationship, I’m afraid others wouldn’t. I mean, I myself sometimes don’t notice how one of the characters is being possessive/creepy unless someone points it out.

    Oh and P.S: Kudos on being a cool mother! 😀

    Reem @ I Read And Tell recently posted: Blogging Advice From A Newbie To A Newbie
    • I loved Dare You To as well, and I agree about the safe sex, and having love be a big part of the story as well. I didn’t include it in my post because it’s labeled as New Adult rather than Young Adult, even if the characters are young enough for YA.

      I agree about the creepiness, too. It is scary, and even I can sometimes overlook the signs. The unhealthy relationships are pretty scary, too, and if we read about them often enough, they tend to almost seem normal.

      😀 thanks for stopping by Reem!

  5. This is a great post, Lexxie. As a mother of teenagers myself, talk of sex and relationships is a concern of mine. In my family, we do openly discuss things, but I agree with you that children may not want to come to their parents for advice about these topics. But I’d like to think that as readers, they’d have books to turn to. But you’re right, many YA books skip sex or portray it in ways that I don’t want my children to believe are normal. Teenagers do need a way to learn about intimacy – safe and realistic intimacy. 🙂

    A few books that came to mind for me are series by Simone Elkeles. Her Perfect Chemistry series, Leaving Paradise books, and even her How to Ruin series all have sex or sexual situations which I think are realistic. And show the relationship as it progresses. I’ll give it some more thought and let you know if any others come to mind.

    Thanks for sharing your thoughts on this important issue, Lexxie.

    • True, I had completely forgotten about Simone Elkeles books. I think I will write a post about YA books that do include safe and loving relationships that also show that teens have sex. One day, you know 🙂

      Thanks for stopping by Brandee! It’s always a pleasure to chat with you 🙂

  6. I guess I’m the opposite – I’ve seen plenty of YA books with sex, and in my experience, many teenagers not only read YA books, but also adult novels, where there’s plenty. I have only 1 boy (about to be 14) – and my thinking is that I’m sure he’s exposed to plenty having to do with sex, that I don’t want any book I share with him to have it. I sort of want it to be his “safe place” since he’s a bit … younger on the maturity. I don’t want him to be innundated – at school, with friends etc. I also want to promote books where there are boys & girls and there’s no talk of love or sex – not because it doesn’t happen in the real world – but because I want him to see that there are relationships between boys & girls that don’t involve one “liking” the other. These are the YA books I find hard to come by. And I’d love some recommendations if anyone has them – he’s not into contemporary books, but likes fiction & light science fiction.

    Tanya Patrice recently posted: Popularity Rules {The July Edition}
    • I can understand that completely, Tanya. But I usually find most of my YA books do not have that. I agree that it is kind of difficult to find a YA book that has no romance at all, though. I think that it’s important to be able to find some books that are more about friendships than anything else, too.

      And it’s true that teenagers don’t only read YA books! But the books that are written for adults often have different subjects and language as well, even if there was no YA to speak of when I was younger, and I read the adult books around the house, the library and elsewhere without any trouble at all.

      What I think is really missing in YA is that if there is romance at all, it should be a balanced relationship. And I would like for that story to show that in a relationship like that, if the characters have sex (and the plot and story are actually moved forward by the sex) it should be described at least a little bit. If the sex is only hinted about, the teens still have nothing to show them how a healthy relationship can be taken to the next level. Safe sex, being careful that both of them actually want this, taking things slow, being respectful of each other and other things that I think are important.

      I think I’ll also make a post in the future about YA books without any romance at all – I think that’s not an easy feat at all.

      Thanks so much for stopping by and sharing your thoughts, Tanya.

    • I do actually agree somewhat here. I have the same problem finding books to suggest to my brother without him thinking that I’m contributing to the pressure (people are constantly asking him when he’s getting a girlfriend).
      I suggested The Hunger Games to him, and then came the love.
      And I suggested the Chaos Walking Trilogy, and then too, came the love!
      At least in both of them it wasn’t the principal focus, but I did wish they could just get on with the adventure.
      Speaking of which, I should suggest Ender’s Game to him…

      BarefootMedStudent recently posted: On Learning, Eventually
      • I agree – it’s really difficult to find books that don’t have a romantic aspect at all. I’m thinking about a post about that as well. I think it’s important to read about friendships just as much as it is to read about love.

  7. I really wish that the vast majority of YA handled sex better than it currently does. I hate it when the protagonists go on and on about kissing as though that’s the be-all and end-all of sexuality. It’s just so unrealistic and tame. As soon as young people start to experiment in one way, they try to push the boundaries and find their own limits. But YA doesn’t talk about that, most of the time. It stops in the PG safe-zone of kissing. That’s why I didn’t read much YA in my teens. I wanted to get the dirt on real romantic relationships, so I read books that were aimed at adults and included naughty bits.

    I really enjoyed Huntley Fitzpatrick’s “My Life Next Door” because it’s the kind of book you mentioned in your post — the teenage characters develop a loving relationship and come to a mutual decision to have sex. It’s romantic but not graphic, so it’s good for the early- to mid-teen set too.

    Abria @ Read. Write. Discuss. recently posted: Grayson by Lynne Cox
    • Thanks so much for the recommendation, Abria! I need to add My Life Next Door to my TBR.

      LOL safe-zone is kind of true when it comes to some books. If there is romance, it should be completely honest – and that honesty should not be afraid to go all the way. But not all YA books need to have romance in them, as Tanya mentioned above. I think PG romance has kind of become the norm, and it’s not really good. There are plenty of relationships that are only about friendship. But those that are romantic tend to go farther than kissing, and I think some YA books are cheating when they pretend sex never happens between consenting teens in a stable relationship.

      Thanks so much for stopping by and taking the time to comment.

  8. I’ve been thinking about the same thing lately. I recently read a YA novel (Born by Tara Brown) which I think had a lot of intimacy and discovery between characters (they were apocalypse survivors and had never really been around other people, so they were older than they should have been) but they still never got to the actual sex part. I think this is one of those things where society just wants a one size fits all answer “sex is bad. sex is bad till your married. sex is bad till your 18” and that line of thinking has never worked.

    But, I will add that since YA doesn’t have a distinct age group,the audience might be 11. It’s not appropriate to have smut marketed to elementary schoolers. So finding a place to draw the line or make a suggestion of intimacy rather than a step by step guide… it’s tricky.
    Great post!

    • Yeah, why should sex be different after 18? And I think it’s quite different in Euorpe, I don’t feel like there’s as much ‘wait to have sex until you’re married’ here as in the US.

      And I don’t want all YA books to have smut nor a step by step guide! Not at all. But it would be nice if a few more managed to not fade to black when the characters do go there. I think it would help to not have sex be ‘dirty’ or something we just don’t talk about.

      And you’re absolutely right, it really is very tricky. Thanks for stopping by and taking the time to comment.

      • I agree with you, I was watching a movie the other day, and it wasn’t for little kids, but it was, I’d say, for middle schoolers. The princess was with child and I hadn’t even seen these 2 hold hands. That’s so awkward. What are we telling kids? It’s really bizarre.

        eightbitbrit recently posted: Feature and Follow Friday #2!
        • Maybe it was immaculate conception? I don’t know, I understand that things can be more or less glossed over, but at the same time I think it’s really important to show that quite often, people love each other and decide to start a family. And people who love each other do tend to at least hold hand, hug and kiss a little bit. This doesn’t need to be the focus of any story, but it could be a part of it.

  9. Great post Lex! Portraying realistic sexual relationships in YA and teen lit is something that I’m really passionate about. There are so many places that teens are getting bad information from – not just their peers or the internet either. Think about the parents and schools and churches that ONLY teach about abstinence! If a kid only learns about abstinence, but is still bent on experiencing sex, there can be horrible consequences like STDs and unwanted pregnancy. So it’s my hope that YA authors will pick up on this gaping hole and try to bring safe, consensual and positive sexual experiences to their work.

    What troubles me that many authors will go out of their way to avoid sex! For instance, in Kiera Cass’s Selection trilogy, it’s completely illegal to have sex! What kind of message is that sending to readers? With every new book (especially light sci-fi and dystopia) the author finds more creative excuses for the characters to not have sex, whether it’s illegal for population control, or immoral according to the reigning gov’t. I find that so ridiculous I’ve nearly given myself eye strain from all the eye rolling.

    As for book recommendations, I’ve got a few. *deep breath* Here goes:

    -Before I Die: about a girl dying of a terminal illness who has a checklist of experiences she wants to have before she dies. This includes a scene with oral sex in it and it’s much less about the sexual act as it is about the MC feeling loved.

    -Grave Mercy: A sex scene towards the end. The MC is the daughter of death and her body has the capacity to heal others. Some people didn’t like how sex was dealt with but I thought it was beautiful.

    -Dark Triumph (Grave Mercy #2): The MC in this one has been sexually active AND sexually abused for quite some time. She finally finds someone she loves and gets a loving, positive sexual experience.

    -Mothership (Isla Neal & Martin Leicht): No actual sex, but this is about a school for pregnant girls… in space.

    -SWEEP series by Cate Tiernan: MC has two sexual relationships over the course of the series (at different times). I think it was handled very appropriately.

    -Graceling & Fire by Kristin Cashore: These books are fantasy and handle sexual relationships so beautifully and realistically. What I think is most important about this series is the diversity in sexual relationships and reproductive health decisions made by the two main characters.

    -Looking for Alaska: Is actually from a boy’s POV and he experiences the most awkward oral sex act in history.

    -If He Had Been With Me: A very touching, heartfelt, loving sexual experience that actually made me cry.

    -The Program by Suzanne Young: Depicts a relationship that is already in full swing by the time the book starts. The couple are sexually active and the author makes it a point to show them using contraception.

    Sooooo… yeah that’s a pretty long list. I hope it helps! Let me know if you or your kids happen to read any of them 😀

    Bekka @ Pretty Deadly Reviews recently posted: Review: All the Truth That’s in Me
  10. Thank you so much for stopping by Becca! I hadn’t thought that much about the religious view-point about sex, because in Europe we talk a lot less about religion, and probably more about sex 😀

    I did have some of the books on your list on my TBR, but I’ve added a new shelf on goodreads – it’s called YA with sex. I will continue to add books to that list, and write another discussion post about this at another time. And I will definitely let you know what my kids think if they read any of them.

    I had forgotten about the sex in the Graceling series, it’s been a while since I read it, and there is a beautiful scene in The Fault in our Stars as well. Making a list with all the books right here is the next step for me, thank you for your help!

    Have a great Sunday 🙂

  11. Love the discussion here. I don’t have kids yet, but I’ve often wondered how I would feel.
    Personally, being a teen is just four years back for me. My parents have always been approachable, but I was so shy and awkward around them that the things that really taught me about sex and intimacy were both at the library: YA novels and medical textbooks (weird).

    So I would love for my kids one day to be able to talk with ME about their concerns, but hopefully they love books and can find solace in YA too.

    I definitely agree with the comment suggesting Looking for Alaska – incredibly funny but also very sweet. I wanted to give the book to my teen brother to read… but then the girl in the awkward moment has the same name as our sister so I’m holding back.

    A book you could definitely suggest to your teens is Eleanor & Park by Rainbow Rowell. It is a genuine relationship that deals with so many outside pressures. They have their own unhealthy issues but it is an incredible book.

    BarefootMedStudent recently posted: On Learning, Eventually
    • Thanks so much for stopping by and contributing to the discussion! I think I’m pretty approachable, and so is my husband, but there are some things teenagers just don’t want their parents to be a part of – even if we can discuss thing in general more detailed questions might be more difficult.

      Medical textbooks is actually a good idea, even if I think my kids know pretty much what is where, and how their bodies work… And I’m guessing at least some medical textbooks have drawings or photos, too? I’ve been surprised at how little some people know about their own anatomy.

      I’m adding Eleanor & Park to my list, as well, thanks for the recommendation.

  12. This is such a great post! I feel like this is a really important discussion to have as it deals with YA and the portrayal of sex I. N YA. It’s hard for me to really decide WHAT I think, because I feel there are so many factors going on here. So here are some of my thoughts(sorry if this becomes a long, overwhelming comment!)

    1)On one hand, relationships in YA are portrayed quite frequently, and I’ve found a lot of good portrayals of RELATIONSHIPS(not so much the sexual aspect, though there have been some books that do a really good job), but while I think this is important, I’d also like to find books without romance. When I was a teenager, I was not in a relationship. Nor did I want to be. And unlike so many story lines, I was never that girl whose eyes were suddenly opened when my soul mate walked past one day. I just didn’t date, and I never really wanted to. Did I have crushes on boys, giggle a bit, etc? Yes. But did I ever really want a relationship in high school? Not really. And I have yet to see a contemporary YA that really addresses characters who just simply have no desire in relationships(and whose minds aren’t changed over the course of the book). So on one hand, I’d like to see more books that don’t even dive into that realm.

    2) Then again, I do want better portrayals of intimacy in YA. As you stated, so often one of the people in the relationship is either a controlling jerk who I just want to slap(WHY is this supposedly attractive?), OR, again, like you said, has more experience. There’s nothing wrong with that, per say, but it doesn’t always lead to the more accurate portrayal of intimacy. Some books never have the relationship progress to that point, and often those are my personal favorite books because I just like slow, sweet relationships. Just a personal preference. BUT I definitely see the need for books to give teens good portrayals of intimacy, and the things that come along with that. Teens have all different romantic experiences–some take relationships really slow physically because of personal convictions, religious reasons, etc. Some dive in quickly. And I see both of these in the real world, so it would be nice to see them in books.

    Stormy @ Book.Blog.Bake. recently posted: The Sunday Wrap Up!(19)
    • Thanks for stopping by and participating in the discussion Stormy.

      It is a very complex question, for sure. And you bring up some very good points. When I was in junior high I had crushes, too, but that’s it. What was important to me when I was between 13 and 16 was my friends, school, other activities I did apart from school, and my family.

      And the jerk part in a lot of YA book is one thing that makes me want something different. What is wrong with a good guy? And what is wrong with taking it slow, getting to know each other, and having fun. The whole soul-mate thing can also give people false expectations, even if I do believe it’s possible to find that special person who can be our soul-mate. I just don’t think that happens as if we recognize that person the first time we lay eyes on them. Slow and sweet is awesome! But, if a story spans over a long time, it would be nice if the way a relationship can change and become more mature over time can be portrayed as well.

      I’m so happy I finally dared to post this – it is very nice to see what different posters think, and I think it’s valid for adults to wonder about how intimacy is shown to teens. I specifically chose the word intimacy over sex, because it’s not the sex itself that is important. But if characters in a book do have sex, I think an honest scene with at least some of what happens between them at that time too should be included.

  13. Awesome post. Since I don’t have children, the scenes in YA romance aren’t something I think about in terms of appropriate-ness. But, I think there are some great points here about learning about intimacy without the graphic things that parents obviously don’t want their kids to be bombarded with. A well written sex scene in YA is typically not very detailed, but the important parts about being seen/loved/respected/etc are totally there.
    Awesome post!!!

    • Thanks for taking the time to comment, Megan! It’s so interesting to see the different points of view on this subject, too. I wrote this with my two oldest children in mind, but I certainly wouldn’t want my 11-year-old to read about sex 🙂 But the respect and love is really important IMO.

  14. I think in YA books, perhaps the people at the top are conservative? Perhaps this dictates what is written as suitable behavior for teens?

    I know in movies and Hollywood, the big dogs are uber conservative. Have you ever wondered why in Hollywood movies, when a character has an unexpected pregnancy, abortion(whether you’re pro choice or life) is never an option. It’s never even spoken.

    Perhaps it may be about values? Who knows?

  15. I hadn’t thought of it from that perspective, so thank you for bringing that up. If the head-people are indeed conservative, that may dictate a lot more than we know.

    Also, since I first wrote this post, I have had this discussion off-line as well, and I think it might be cultural in part as well. In Europe, I think we’re more open about sex, talking about it, realizing teenagers do it, and don’t mind it it books and movies (and even TV shows).

    Thanks for taking the time to participate in the discussion 🙂

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